Transcript: Weekly Report with Lyndon LaRouche: Wednesday, Oct. 12, 2011
October 13, 2011 • 3:57PM

And Now, with the United States, Russia and China, We Have, the Great Dream to Unite Humanity Around this Common Purpose

ALICIA CERRETANI: Hello, and welcome to this week's edition of LPAC Weekly Report. Today is Oct. 12th, I'm Alicia Cerretani, and joining me are Sky Shields from the Basement and Lyndon LaRouche.

Now, just for starters, I think it's important to start with today's news, which is a follow-up on a warning that you had issued this past weekend, which we posted on the LPAC site [http://www.larouchepac.com/node/19817], which is that given the meltdown of the trans-Atlantic system, the hopeless collapse of the financial system, and governments along with it, the Obama administration and the people that control that administration would have no choice, but to go for a Hitler coup inside the United States.

And what we've discussed on the website, and what you've said a number of times, is that this is something that has been in the making, since, essentially, in terms of setting up the infrastructure for a coup inside the United States, since George Bush Sr.; and that you have a nest of people inside the United States, who are American citizens, who have been Presidents before, who have been in the highest levels of government, but whose intention is to take the United States down. And we've seen that expressed most viciously through the Obama Administration, where he has outdone himself and outdone the Bush and Cheney Administration, in terms of spying on the American people, undermining the U.S. Constitution, working with foreign enemies of the United States.

Now, you had said in the warning, on Saturday, that they are now in a race to establish a coup, because Obama has discredited himself in the eyes of not just the American people, but the world abroad. So the question is, how is he possibly going to remain in power? Where is his power going to come from, to reign in the United States?

LYNDON LAROUCHE: Well, what you have, essentially, is you go back to the 1920s, go back to the election campaign of Franklin Roosevelt. In this period, the Hoover Administration had set up a famous coup, in case it were not elected. The minute that Franklin Roosevelt was elected, then an international coup operation was set into motion. It was set into motion by Wall Street and by the British, and the British were running Wall Street. And the grandfather of the most recent Bush President, was a key part, supporting the Hitler operation in that period.

Now, what happened, then, in the 2000s, when Bush was President, he moved to set, under his administration, to make certain changes in the organization of the U.S. government, which allowed for a coup process to be set into process: That is, to take the power of the military away from the regular military, and create a new military institution which would be operating in secret, which would be prepared to make a coup against the United States. And the Obama Administration is a part of that coup, as George Bush Jr. is also a part of that organization; Cheney is a key figure in it.

That operation has been built up continuously, as under Dick Cheney's leadership in part, to prepare a coup against the American people. Now, remember, compare what happened in the United States with the attempted coup against Roosevelt, which was frustrated, but it was just like the Hitler coup, exactly like it.

So, the German people found themselves with a new, silly guy called Hitler, as their appointed new Chancellor. The people in Germany largely, especially the Liberals and so forth, were ridiculing Hitler: "Aw, this bum is going to be out of there soon, we're going to have a new election, he'll be gone." What happened was, the burning of the Reichstag, the Reichstagsbrand, was then used to set up a dictatorship in Germany, and to have this done before Franklin Roosevelt actually occupied the office of President. And a lot of people were hauled away and killed, some immediately, some later: A great butchery, which was organized by the British.

The British monarchy organized Hitler's coming to power in Germany, with the Wall Street crowd, as usual. So you have today, the same thing: You have the Wall Street crowd, together with their British cronies, monetarist cronies, are setting up a coup against the United States. Now, this coincides with the fact that President Obama is losing all popularity whatsoever; but so was Hitler. So you have the failed attempt at a Nazi-like coup in the United States, under Franklin Roosevelt. But we had such a coup, in Germany, and we have such a coup in process now.

CERRETANI: Right. And there's more at stake right now, because it's the whole trans-Atlantic system that is completely insolvent. We saw that yesterday, the Slovakian government fell, when they were the one nation inside the European Union, who voted against the expansion of the EFSF. Subsequently, after that vote of "no," their government fell apart, and now the European Union is scrambling to try to figure out how to pass this thing.

LAROUCHE: Well, the main thing they're looking for, is to stall the ouster of Obama in the United States, and to set into motion a coup, inside the United States. You see our military's been ruined by these crazy wars overseas. So now we have the fake military, a special group, trained by people like Cheney and similar, a private organization prepared to do the same thing as the Nazi apparatus did with Hitler. And Obama is the keystone of the operation to pull a Hitler coup against the people of the United States.

CERRETANI: 'Cause he's crazy enough to do it.

LAROUCHE: Well, he's insane and immoral enough, it doesn't make any difference to him. He's essentially a clown, a puppet. And he's a puppet of Wall Street and London.

CERRETANI: Right.

LAROUCHE: And the point is, we've got to get this guy out of office. He's insane. He's violated the law, he's impeachable: We've got to get him out! If we don't get him out, then you will never — the United States will never escape, from something like a Hitler drive in the United States. This man has to be removed from office now, and you have the lesson of what didn't happen in the United States under Franklin Roosevelt, and what did happen under Hitler. And this is the kind of situation we face.

We have to have people who — our gutless members of Congress are a typical problem: They won't face reality. The evidence is there! All the relevant people in the United States, who are specialists, know that this danger is there! But! Nobody in the institutions is willing to step up and deal with the threat! Who's going to save the nation from a new Hitler? And that's the question that has to be asked.

And people who said, "Well, we've got to go along to get along. We'll deal with this our way." That's what they said when Hitler was coming to power in Germany. And this has gone on and on, again, in European and trans-Atlantic history. And it's continuing again now. And all our gutless wonders in the Congress and elsewhere, are all ducking the issue: That as long as this man, who's a British stooge, that's all he is, he's a puppet — as long as he remains in power, he is determined, by orders of his management, to pull off such a coup. And if we want to save our own lives, from something like a Hitler phenomenon in the United States, this guy has got to be removed on one of two grounds, or both: First, he's committed crimes against the Constitution, impeachable! Secondly, he's insane, and under the Section 4 of the 25th Amendment, he's out. Or he's in a suspended position. Once he gets into a suspended position, this stuff stops.

So getting Obama out of office, and we have the grounds to do so, is the key to saving the lives of the people of the United States, among other things.

CERRETANI: Right. And everything that has broken open, just this year, in terms of a mass strike, what started in the spring over in Europe and in Yemen and Egypt, that hasn't stopped. As a matter of fact, that's escalating, and it's moving in a very dangerous direction, because Obama's still in office here. Those protests have now spread into the United States. because the economic conditions, there's no future to the younger people in this country.

So the problem is, you have a lot of noise, right now, everywhere, and it's not going to get any quieter. The only way it's going to resolve itself, into some sort of a lawful ordering, is if people understand the principles that are at play. And that's an immediate job, is to educate the people who have some sense, — some sense that not only is there not a future, but we're sitting on a very short fuse right now, in terms of a First World nation, many First World nations. We see what's happened in Greece: You had a First World nation dive into a dark age, in less than a year.

So, there's no reason why that situation, and it is spreading, is not coming here to the United States. And that means there has to be a rapid education as to what it is — number one, what a human being is, and number two, what a human economy looks like; and what our true environment is. What is the environment that we're acting in?

And from there, you really see that what we have around Obama, we have around the British, and the whole international financial empire, is this barbaric, Roman Empire, rewarmed Roman Empire thing that needs to be destroyed — not compromised with, but destroyed. Otherwise, as you said, we will have no civilization. There's no compromising with this thing.

LAROUCHE: The optimistic aspect of this process, apart from what the United States represents and what the guts in the American people do, they need the leadership — they will do what's necessary in large part; they know what they need, in large part. They need leadership, which we're being deprived of, as long as this President is in office; you can't have leadership with this man in office. But the other side of the thing is, we have in Russia, China, and potentially India, but Russia and China are more likely to lead in a process like this now, we have the basis for a trans-Pacific economic orientation.

Europe, for the moment, doesn't function. All the governments of Central and Western continental Europe are not functional now, under this financial swindle of which they're victims. They've lost their sovereignty, they've given up their national sovereignty in favor of the euro system. So the trans-Atlantic region, momentarily, does not function.

But China and Russia, and implicitly India would join, I think tend to do that sort — we have a trans-Pacific orientation, which is typified by the NAWAPA project for the Western United States, Western and Central United States. Therefore, we have the immediate prospect, and the Russians and Chinese are doing it now, for our partnership of the United States with Russia and China, and other nations of the trans-Pacific region, to revive the world economy on that initiative, and thus bring Europe back into its proper role as an economy, a European national economy. We're at the point where that can occur.

And what we need is the imagination, not just fantastic imagination, but the imagination to see the truth, what we can do: If we can get this President out now, while we still have a country, then we will be able to inspire people in the United States. We know, because they want employment, they want real employment, they want real economy, and we can give it to them. We, ourselves, and especially in cooperation with Russia and China, who are the major powers in the Pacific region, together with us. And therefore, we have an option. The question is, will we seize the option that we have, which starts with agreement with Russia and China, with us. That gives us the option for going back to a civilized form of life.

SKY SHIELDS: Seriously, what we need to get across, the question that people really do need to understand, is: Well, how, exactly do you act on history? 'Cause, I think, looking at some of these things, looking at the coup from — looking at the threat represented by Obama, people tend to treat it as though you're acting on objects, or as though these are objects acting together, and you recognize these are clear; how can you have such certainty of what the intention is that Obama represents? It's not because he's capable internally of manifesting this; but it's also not because it's being whispered to him by other people. There's a principle here, what you've identified as the oligarchical principle, and you've got people who resonate with that; that's the form that a real conspiracy takes. It's not notes being passed back and forth, it's based on your view of the way the universe works, based on the state of your mind at this moment, what principles do you resonate with, and what drives you?

In this case, he resonates with an oligarchical principle, and our mode of action has got to be to act on those sorts of processes. We should view what's happening with the Russia-China situation in those terms, not in terms of point-to-point interaction.

LAROUCHE: I'm very, of course, as you know, I'm very much involved with promoting the role of Russia, together with China, as our key partners at this moment, once we have our real nation back again, — our key partners, which means, jobs, income, everything, for our people in the United States alone. If we have that, we can rebuild our economy. We can stop a horrible thing that's happening to us right now, and we need that. And we have to understand that.

I'm very much concerned with Russia and China. I have a closer historical relationship to Russia, and to certain circles in Russia, than I do to any other part of the trans-Pacific region. You had some more friends in Japan, in earlier times, and so forth. But, we, together, the United States, together with Russia and China, are the potential linchpins of the salvation of civilization on Earth.

SHIELDS: And that's crucial to realize what it is; it's civilization that you're talking about. The whole human species has a direction of development. And it's not the interaction between the U.S. and Russia. Your historical interaction with them has always been on a level of the highest questions of scientific principle. That's not a coincidence: It's because, the human species has always depended upon escaping from some — the only way you can escape entropy as a process, the way you can escape this with the steady downward collapse that all the rest of the abiotic universe moves into outside of creative activity, is if you can take whatever happens to be the fixed logical system at any given moment, of known facts, known relationships, and introduce a new principle that hasn't existed. If you don't bring a new principle into play, and you don't do this regularly, the result's going to be collapse.

But if you're going to bring a new principle into play, it's got to be something on the scale of all humanity. And right now the only nations that are situated to do that are ourselves, Russia, and China, most immediately. Because that's the relationship that's capable of shifting the balance globally, and not just moving — I think it's very important.

It's very hard, because people picture this globe map; it's not just moving from one place on the surface of the globe to something else. You're reconnecting regions. You're setting — if you picture it as sort of a transformation, you're reconnecting, you're changing the interconnections of the human species in such a fashion, that's a qualitative upshift. That if you were to view it in terms of trade routes, view it in terms of communications systems, view it in terms of transportation routes, this development up through NAWAPA, connecting across the Bering Strait, down into Russia; opening up the Arctic, taking this massive Arctic coastline that you've got in Russia, what's connected across the Bering Strait, over into Alaska, with Canada, suddenly you're building a new kind of — if you were to picture the phase-space in which that economic activity took place, it's a complete transformation, the kind you described with the sorts of tensor relationships you take from General Relativity.

LAROUCHE: Yeah, yeah. Well, this, of course, is what historically...we had people, largely from England, at that point, but a certain group in England, and other things in Europe had not worked; the oligarchy was too strong. And also the failure of the Spanish colonies, because of the Habsburg control [they] were also corrupted. They had potential, but it was destroyed by the Habsburg reach. So, therefore, when we — Plymouth Rock was settled upon, and then the Massachusetts Bay Colony was part of that. We introduced into North America, and into what became the United States, we introduced an idea of European civilization which was more advanced than that existed in Europe.

SHIELDS: Right.

LAROUCHE: And this was the irony of the Massachusetts Bay Colony and its legacy.

So from the time of the Massachusetts Bay Colony, as we were in struggle against England and others, as England became an empire, — the British became an empire — we developed a form of European civilization among leading circles inside what became the United States, which was the actual driver of all progress of European civilization since that time.

So, up until a more recent time, when we began to have more people from Asia coming into the United States as part of our citizenry, we were essentially a European culture, with all the advantages of European culture in terms of intellectual commitment, but with European background. So we had a corrupted European background in Europe, based on the oligarchical system; we had taken the best that we got from Europe, we brought into North America and places like that, and thus, we created what became the American Revolution.

Now, since that time, the contest has been, since 1763, since that particular Peace of Paris, since that time, there's been a constant struggle, between the American tendency and the British imperial tendency, and it is an empire. We have influenced Europe: For example, Germany freed itself, with Bismarck, by going directly to the model of Abraham Lincoln, and Germany is the creation of Abraham Lincoln's influence on Germany.

So we had great movements in Europe: You had influence in Russia of the same kind of tendency. So we had great movements reciprocally, in Europe, in the same direction as the United States. We also then moved on, later, to — as we have in our country today — more of an Oriental orientation, as such, as our Chinese population, in particular, our Chinese-origin population and the Chinese are playing a much bigger role, and will play a bigger role now, than ever before, in the trans-Pacific role.

And Russia has moved, now, in its development program, toward the Pacific side, as Putin's leadership has done, in particular.

So, we're now in a situation, that's what we're up to. If we go back to this, and we can, then we have all the ingredients to play a leading role, in concert with what can escape this European oligarchical grip by the British, in terms of Russia and China, which will lead, essentially from the Pacific development program, which will start immediately with the NAWAPA program. The NAWAPA program will start this thing going, on a historic scale.

So, we have this wonderful opportunity.

SHIELDS: Right! And obviously, the way you just laid that out, I want to draw — because it's a point you made in this recent paper, if people have seen it — "Three Steps to Recovery?" that's now posted on the website [http://www.larouchepac.com/node/19759] — but the way you just describe time, in that discussion there, there's a process you go into detail in this paper about, about the process of seeming regression, as you describe in Europe prior to the establishment of the Massachusetts Bay Colony here in the United States, what was to become the United States, you get this regression in Europe, but out of that process of regression, you get this leapfrogging, taking the most backwards area of the planet at the time, the underdeveloped Americas, and you use that to leapfrog Europe. So in the course of that backward motion, you also get this leap forward.

Same thing, as you describe with the case with Bismarck, in that case.

LAROUCHE: Well, you also have Cusa, Nicholas of Cusa: And Nicholas of Cusa and what he led, or was a leading figure of, in the Florentine Renaissance, and the Florentine Renaissance, even though it was defeated by the oligarchical forces in large part, that Renaissance in European civilization was a fundamental change in European policy and direction. And that led to everything that was great in the trans-Atlantic region, was this thing.

And so, we're doing the same thing again: I'm in a sense a follower of Nicholas of Cusa, in that sense, and, as Helga is also, very much that. But, that perspective, the Cusa perspective, which is, you know, when he was about to die, he told his friends that Europe was going to be crushed by the oligarchy, and the Christian church was going to be crushed by the oligarchy, too. So, he said, the thing we have to do, is we have to send people across the great oceans, to get people away from Europe, and to build up a civilization based on these principles, over the ocean. And that's what's happened: That, despite all the setbacks, despite all the evil, this dedication of some Europeans typified by Nicholas of Cusa as the leading exponent of this, the man who gave us modern science was Nicholas of Cusa, essentially, and so this thing is now there. That's what we have. That's our legacy.

And if we begin to understand how that works, and what the human being is, as the difference between a human being and an animal — which unfortunately few people seem to understand these days — then we have the possibility of realizing Cusa's intention, of that kind of civilization which we once thought of as European civilization, as modern European civilization. And now, with the cooperation with Russia and China, which is emerging, we have, at last, the great dream of going across all oceans, to unite humanity around this common purpose. And we just have to understand what the challenge is.

SHIELDS: Yeah, that has to be the intent. This is not some simple question of geopoliticking. This is a question of really, doing the same thing as you just described: Overcoming the rot of the trans-Atlantic relationship, by reestablishing human civilization at a higher level around the trans-Pacific and in the development of the Arctic. It's the same. That's got the same kind of imperative to it, as moving across the ocean from Europe to the Americas.

LAROUCHE: The other side is that the enemy has always been, as far as we have a record of civilization, the enemy has always been what's called the oligarchical principle.

The Roman Empire, in all its phases, including the fourth phase which is called the British Empire, have all represented pure evil. And when we talk about the "evil of Europe," we're talking about that tradition, the oligarchical principle: The first Rome; Byzantium, the second Rome; then the system of the Crusaders, which was the third Rome, the first Venetian system; then we have the second Venetian system, which is now the British Empire.

And so, the world is dominated by this corruption called imperial systems, of which Rome is not the first, but Rome was the most significant, in terms of what it did, in grabbing both the trans-Atlantic region, as well as the Mediterranean region, and that's the enemy we have to fight, and eliminate today. We have to free humanity, from the imprisonment under the oligarchical imperial tradition.

SHIELDS: Right. And as you described, people have to have the imagination to describe what a future state is; people have to realize that that can vanish. This is not some perpetual battle of good versus evil, that lasts forever. This is relatively an adolescence of our species; as we move into our adulthood, that's the end. You're not going to bring this into our extraterrestrial imperative. Oligarchism can not be taken off the planet. We won't leave with it.

LAROUCHE: No. No, no, it won't. So, we have a great opportunity, and we've come to a point, where the British Empire, which is about to go down, is in its last gasp, of an attempt to bring about a permanent dictatorship over this planet. And our job is to crush that! And to recognize that people in the United States who are in leading positions, are traitors to the United States, because they're supporting the imperial system, as against our constitutional system. And we have to get our constitutional system back! And we have to get it back, with a better understanding of it, than we've shown most of the time, up to now.

And we've got to reach out to people, in Asia, for example, as in Russia, or the greater area of Russia, and China, India, and so forth. We've got to reach out to these people, in cooperation. Because you can no longer have wars! You can no longer have wars on this planet! The idea of armies and wars is gone! When you think about the kind of weapons systems that war involves today, among major powers, civilization could not withstand that! The time for the end of warfare, has come: And it can only come by unity among different cultures, which agree on a common purpose, which is the republican purpose; which is our purpose, our heritage. And it's up to us, to do that.

There are things, as we have brewing among us, here — there are things we can do in a very practical way, to change the preconditions for success of this type. It's available to us. And that's what my remaining duties, for the rest of my life is that.

SHIELDS: And you know, since we're in a position to do it, to reclaim those principles, the principles on which our nation was founded, are not simply national principles: They're universal principles. And the trick now, as you said, like the same thing, you reach all the way back to what the origin was. You reach back to Cusa, you reach back to their source, and then you spread that globally, as actual universal human principle.

LAROUCHE: And it is the human principle. Mankind's nature is not an animal nature. Human beings are consciously capable of creativity. No animal species is consciously capable of creativity. The Roman system, the Roman imperial system, imperialism in general, is reduction of mankind to a beast. That's what you see as Wall Street! Wall Street are species of beasts!

SHIELDS: Explicitly! Admittedly!

LAROUCHE: Yeah.

SHIELDS: The idea, they apply survival of the fittest as a method, that's what monetarism is, free trade, all these things are animal models, really.

LAROUCHE: Yeah, and that's where we stand. But the key thing is, first, we have to fight this thing off, prevent it from taking over again, because it could be the end of the human race, especially now; and we have to build mankind's conception of mankind, on a higher level. And that's what my most recent paper is dedicated to, of course.

CERRETANI: Yeah, you said it last night: You said, that either, because of the technology we have today, a world war among major powers is not an option, or you will be looking at the end of civilization. So you either kill the technology, which will kill people, or, you kill people in a war, which will kill people. And you get that sense of non-option, that actually does give you a very real sense of how things are moving forward. There is a directionality to the universe in which we live. And there are funny circumstances, but it gives you a sense that we are now in a position where we are forced to move diplomacy forward, economic principles forward, culture generally, we have to push it forward, otherwise we will face the demise of our civilization, and that's not an option.

It may be an option for a few creepy, half-animal/half-beast-people on the planet. But if people get that sense around the planet, particularly with the kind of shift in power globally, that is represented by the Chinese, the Russians, and in alliance with the United States, we can inaugurate that, immediately. And it's now.

And so, the people still defending this imperial system, they're going to be finished one way or another, because it can no longer exist. The universe will go on without us.

LAROUCHE: The problem is that most people, including members of the Senate and the House of Representatives, are cowards. Why are they cowards? Because they have the access to the knowledge needed to recognize this evil and to do something about it. But they feel, that we have to go along to get along, which is, ironically, the motto of the Congress: Go along to get along. But, go where? And we see where "go where" has meant right now!

So, it's only, as in the case of the American Revolution: It's an exceptional group of people, who are devoted to humanity as a principle, as distinct from the beasts, who actually lead people, against their own cowardly inclinations, to fight for their freedom. And I've been at this for a long time — I've been shot at, in a sense, and so forth, and I've been shot at, precisely because I came close to too much power, in the eyes of the enemy. And that happens to most people who do as I do. Most people who come into my kind of work, give in. Their wife tells them to give in, "Learn to go along to get along. Look, our family, don't get our family involved in this political mess. Give in! Learn to get along! And go along."

And therefore, people who are intelligent, otherwise, who are qualified to lead, otherwise, become cowards. And they give in! They sell their souls, to the enemy, for the famous bowl of pottage. They give in.

And a few of us, and there are a few of us in the United States, who are of the same disposition I am, who have been through the business of leadership in dealing with great issues, and having some impact on them, and getting into trouble because you do have some impact on things, and there are a few of us — too few! And our only defense is to show people that there is an option for them. And you find it mostly among younger people. It's like the principle of warfare: When you recruited troops for regular warfare, as in the United States, in past times, you would go generally between 18 and 38; between 18 and 38 is about the limit for regular combat function, or training for combat function. And so, that generation, instinctively, tends to have more courage of that form, than the older generation which feels more defeated.

Some of us in the older generations, we're not defeated: We never give it up! But most people when they get older, they begin to retreat, "Well, I can't fight any more. Look, I'm going to retire soon. I want a comfortable, safe life. Don't get us into trouble!" And so, they give in!

And therefore, it's only a tiny minority of the total population, that are leadership. But that minority, which does exist in our United States, is very important! The entirety, the saving of the United States as a nation, depends upon that group, of which I'm a part! We're the leadership. Because we are old, we hopefully have some wisdom as a result of having age; we've had experience with these problems, we know what the enemy's like, we know what the problems are. And it's a question of mobilizing our forces to act when people realize they need our action.

And this is a very fun thing for me, because it involves the work I do is what pleases me, satisfies me the most.

CERRETANI: The excuse, to say, "we're going to get in a lot of trouble if we make waves," is, in a period of time in history like this, I mean, everybody's in a lot of trouble! So, the excuse only holds up so much, when you say, "well, I can't do this, because I'll be in a lot of trouble." It's like, well — we're already in a lot of trouble, so, I think it's worth the risk, at this point!

SHIELDS: It's the object-fixation again.

CERRETANI: Right.

SHIELDS: It's exactly that. The problem is not the immediate thing standing in front of you. The problem is what's the process that's driving that thing towards you? And right now, it's a question of, there are principles that are acting at play, and our ability for survival depends upon our ability to act directly on those. That's the source of human mortality.

LAROUCHE: And that's what I devoted this particular piece I've just written to, exactly that. Most people have no understanding of how humanity functions. They don't understand the actual role of humanity in society. They have things they think are true, they've been taught and so forth, which really do not determine how society functions.

SHIELDS: Right, right.

LAROUCHE: You have the standard curriculum, the standard way of thinking, and these things are incompetent, when you go up against reality!

SHIELDS: You know, people should study this piece closely, I mean, even if you've read it once already. People should take a look at this, and again, go section by section: Because what you lay out there, really is something that could function as the principled guideline to the establishment of future human civilization. That's what it is. It's a question of, if we're going to survive — if all objects are ephemeral, if all events, all things that seem to be sense-perceptually the most valid, are going to vanish, and they are; in a crisis period, those things disappear, they die, they're mortal in that sense — then you have to be equipped to recognize, and to act on, as the most tangible, those things that are invisible and immortal.

And what you wrote, what you have as a paper, this "Three Steps to Recovery?" really does equip people to do that. And that has to become something that's an object of conscious mentation, not an accident, not something that just happens to be stumbled upon by a smaller grouping, but something that becomes a current in culture.

LAROUCHE: Well, we find — I find, in particular, that I can recognize exactly the steps by which people are discouraged, demoralized, and disoriented, from being able to locate and deal with the great challenges before us. And I mean, people tend to believe in sense-perception, and they think in terms of sense-perception. And that really is not human, that's animal. And therefore, getting people to understand, what is the nature of mankind? What is human creativity? How does it function? What are the passions? What makes people creative, and some people not creative?

And this is what's important, is to inspire people who become creative, and become what we call "geniuses." Because they give way, to abandoning this standard litany of "be practical," and so forth, to see what creativity really is, what human creativity is. And see how this affects the future existence of mankind, within this galaxy! And to step up to the plate on that one!

And that, to me, is the most satisfying thing, the most satisfying kind of work you can get to do. And what I'm trying to do, in this case, is get some more people to understand the great pleasure which awaits them on the other side of this thing! [laughs]

SHIELDS: Right. That's exciting. That's quite a task: It's a noble task, and it's the most fun one!

LAROUCHE: It is! I have more fun than anyone, and more enemies than anyone! [laughter]

CERRETANI: All right.

LAROUCHE: That's about it.

CERRETANI: Yes. Shall we end it there?

SHIELDS: That sounds good, that sounds like a solid point.

CERRETANI: Yes, people can get to his paper.

SHIELDS: Yeah, take a look, print copies of it. Organize reading groups! I mean, this should be something that — the paper is something that needs to be discussed. This is something that should be worked through, it should be treated as a solid scientific document. And I think it'll be linked probably somewhere underneath this broadcast.

CERRETANI: Yes, we can do that.

LAROUCHE: Good, thank you.

CERRETANI: All right, thank you, and we'll see you next week.